{"id":1572053,"date":"2024-03-25T07:00:00","date_gmt":"2024-03-25T07:00:00","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/thecreativeindependent.com\/people\/writer-artist-and-educator-tatiana-johnson-boria-on-navigating-different-kinds-of-creative-relationships"},"modified":"2024-03-25T07:00:00","modified_gmt":"2024-03-25T07:00:00","slug":"writer-artist-and-educator-tatiana-johnson-boria-on-navigating-different-kinds-of-creative-relationships","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/radiofree.asia\/2024\/03\/25\/writer-artist-and-educator-tatiana-johnson-boria-on-navigating-different-kinds-of-creative-relationships\/","title":{"rendered":"Writer, artist, and educator Tatiana Johnson-Boria on navigating different kinds of creative relationships"},"content":{"rendered":"

What was the starting point for you as a writer? At what point did you decide, \u201cOh, this is kind of what I want to dedicate my life to\u201d?<\/strong><\/p>\n\n

It\u2019s a bit of a winding road. In high school, I started learning about poetry in general, learning that Black people could write poems and that there were poems by Black people in the world. Our teacher had us do this assignment through Poetry Out Loud<\/a>. We had to choose a poem, and I found one by Nikki Giovanni<\/a>. We had to recite it, and it felt so freeing to read her poem aloud, and I just kind of fell in love with it then.<\/p>\n\n

After that, I wrote stuff and I never really thought I could be a poet or a writer for a very long time. I went to film school. And throughout film school, I was just writing poems the whole time. And I remember my advisor was like, \u201cWell, did you think about getting an MFA in creative writing?\u201d And I realized maybe I was in the wrong program.<\/p>\n\n

Then I got my MFA and worked at the same time, so I wouldn\u2019t have to take out loans, which was very difficult. But I think it was honestly then when I started thinking, \u201cOkay, maybe I am a writer.\u201d I still feel like that. Some days, I\u2019m like, \u201cAm I a writer?\u201d<\/span><\/p>\n\n

That\u2019s so funny because you literally have written books<\/a>! Of course, you are! But I get it. A lot of writers still question if they\u2019re really writers.<\/strong><\/p>\n\n

I was just thinking about this the other day. When you\u2019re an artist, you\u2019re kind of outside of the conventions of making money, so it feels like what you do isn\u2019t being affirmed.<\/span> And you\u2019re constantly trying to affirm it for yourself, but it\u2019s a strange relationship. So I think that might be why I still feel this way because I don\u2019t get to do this all the time. And it\u2019s not making me the money I need to sustain my life.<\/p>\n\n

It\u2019s a common conundrum, this question of, \u201cAt what point in my life will I feel like I\u2019m an artist?\u201d Do I need to publish one book, two books? Do I need to be making this much money or that much money? I think it\u2019s hard and you said it so well. You\u2019re also an educator and a coach. How has teaching and coaching helped you view your own writing practice with more clarity?<\/strong><\/p>\n\n

One of the things I always say when I\u2019m working with writers is that you are a writer, the only difference between you and someone published is just being published. We\u2019re all practicing in that art form. And so that\u2019s something I try to instill in people. Especially because we don\u2019t often hold our work in the same regard as maybe someone who\u2019s published a book that we look up to.<\/span> The real difference is the publication and all the other stuff that comes along with that. I try to help people look at their own work with that same reverence and I\u2019m always like, \u201cOh, yeah, I have to do that, too.\u201d It\u2019s an ongoing decision or choice you have to make about yourself.<\/span> [Teaching and coaching] are reminding me of that. They\u2019re teaching me the vision I have is worthy of time and investment.<\/p>\n\n

So many of us spend all day online just comparing ourselves to what other people are doing, it makes sense that people are reaching out to you for guidance.<\/strong><\/p>\n\n

It\u2019s understated how much community matters for writers, and the right community, too. In publishing, there\u2019s obviously a lot of gatekeeping, it\u2019s very easy to feel excluded. So, of course you\u2019re going to be like, \u201cDoes this make sense? What am I doing?\u201d Having a community that cultivates and uplifts you is a way to combat that.<\/p>\n\n

I totally agree. How do you go about protecting your creative side from the demands and pressures of the publishing world?<\/strong><\/p>\n\n

That\u2019s something I\u2019m still learning. It\u2019s been especially hard because I\u2019m working on a long-form nonfiction project. And this is a project that I have with an agent, which is different. She showed it to publishing people and there was a lot of positive feedback, but then there was a lot of stuff that I was like, wow, people say some [crazy] stuff about people\u2019s work. I was trying not to take it personally, but how do you not internalize that? And how do you feel motivated to continue with your project? So I\u2019ve been trying to find some rituals for myself. For example, I\u2019m really into tarot so anytime I\u2019m about to start writing on this particular project, I pull a tarot card and it usually affirms what I\u2019m doing. These very tangible rituals have helped protect me. Also reading stuff that I felt like I desperately needed makes me feel like, okay, maybe this book can exist in the world.<\/span><\/p>\n\n

There\u2019s this essay<\/a> by Kiese Laymon, who wrote the book Heavy<\/i>. In [the essay], he talks about his experience working with publishers on that. And it seems really bad what happened, all these years he worked on it and didn\u2019t have a good relationship with the editor. It was just a mess. I think he had to republish it. When I read it, I was like, \u201cWow, if he had this experience with the publisher, what is it going to be like for me?\u201d But also that\u2019s not something I would\u2019ve ever known unless I read that essay. It\u2019s just very unclear what that world is like. It can be really damaging to your self-esteem.<\/p>\n\n

Like you\u2019re saying, it\u2019s an ongoing process. I recently read this book called My Trade Is a Mystery<\/a><\/i> by Carl Phillips. It\u2019s a collection of seven essays, each one related to a different element of the writing life. I think it\u2019s ambition, stamina, practice, audience, politics, silence, and community. Either in the ambition or stamina chapter, Phillips talks about how, often, we look to publishers and the market for some sort of sign that we are good enough. But like what you\u2019re saying, it gives us the opposite effect, it makes us feel worse. He says to just focus on the work. The work and community. Those are the only things that ultimately can keep us going because those are the things that have the most depth and the most life. Also, he\u2019s a Black, queer man and he also talks about how community based only on identity can sometimes feel empty, which was really interesting.<\/strong><\/p>\n\n

That feels very true! Even in some communities where it\u2019s like, for example, \u201cthis is for Black poets,\u201d even that can sometimes feel like, I don\u2019t have a space there, or I don\u2019t know the right people. It\u2019s hard.<\/p>\n\n

There\u2019s this idea, in the online world at least, that when you find your people you\u2019ll just immediately feel right at home and you\u2019ll feel so reified and so affirmed. But that hasn\u2019t really been my experience. I do meet amazing people here and there but I don\u2019t know, community can feel so amorphous. What has your experience been like?<\/strong><\/p>\n\n

I feel like that is really spot on. I have definitely experienced what you\u2019re saying. I remember taking a workshop with this writer, a Black writer, but I just didn\u2019t feel held in that space. It has surprised me, the spaces where I have felt held even when maybe the people do not even have the same identity as me. It\u2019s something I\u2019ve talked to a couple of my friends about, trying to understand. But there are different types of relationships too. I feel like some of them are transactional kinds of relationships, and some of them are actually friendships. You don\u2019t want to enter a space in which you\u2019re forcing either thing, but you also want to feel good.<\/p>\n\n

Exactly.<\/strong><\/p>\n\n

Publishing sometimes does rely on relationships and who you know so that complicates things.<\/p>\n\n

It can feel very\u2026sore. I think that\u2019s why Carl Phillips\u2019s book really spoke to me. Even when he speaks about trying to find community, he brings up something that I found to be really meaningful. He says, \u201cWe tend to think of a writing community as a community of writers, but I find I still prefer the community not [of] writers, but what they\u2019ve written.\u201d And I was like, woah!<\/strong><\/p>\n\n

That\u2019s a little mind-blowing.<\/p>\n\n

Despite how hard it is to build community, why does it still feel like a worthwhile thing for you to pursue?<\/strong><\/p>\n\n

I\u2019m going to share an example first. I have a friend who happens to be a poet and writer. We became friends first before I knew she was a writer. We were doing an event about Phyllis Wheatley, and we were celebrating these letters that were uncovered<\/a> between Phyllis Wheatley and Obour Tanner, who were both enslaved Black women in New England, and how they were just connecting to each other via these letters, affirming each other\u2019s existence. And I remember she said something like, \u201cThis is our friendship. We\u2019re sharing these letters, and sometimes you may not hear from me or I may not hear from you. But we have this line that connects us in this way that we see each other and we are looking out for each other.\u201d<\/span><\/p>\n\n

And that\u2019s what I think community means to me, a real care and almost a protection of another person, and wanting to see what\u2019s best for them, wanting them to shine.<\/span> I think that requires some real fundamental trust with another person, that comes with just building a relationship. But I think the people that I\u2019m in community with, oftentimes I feel like I became their friends before writing was even involved. Or the other times, when there\u2019s writing involved, I feel like they\u2019ve just been open and receptive to connecting just to connect. And when I can sense that somebody really cares about me, not to get something out of our relationship, but just genuinely cares, as a human being, that\u2019s always worthwhile.<\/span><\/p>\n\n

\n\n

Tatiana Johnson-Boria recommends:<\/b>
<\/p>\n\n

Papier wellness journals
<\/a><\/i>
<\/p>\n\n

Star Seed Oracle
<\/a><\/i>
<\/p>\n\n

Designing Motherhood
<\/a><\/i>
<\/p>\n\n

Poetry as Spell Casting: Poems, Essays, and Prompts for Manifesting Liberation and Reclaiming Power
<\/a><\/i>
<\/p>\n\n

We Can Do Hard Things<\/i> podcast<\/a>
<\/p>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n

This post was originally published on The Creative Independent<\/a>. <\/p>","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

What was the starting point for you as a writer? At what point did you decide, \u201cOh, this is kind of what I want to dedicate my life to\u201d?<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":2253,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[268,270],"tags":[],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/radiofree.asia\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/1572053"}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/radiofree.asia\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/radiofree.asia\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/radiofree.asia\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2253"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/radiofree.asia\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=1572053"}],"version-history":[{"count":2,"href":"https:\/\/radiofree.asia\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/1572053\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":1572282,"href":"https:\/\/radiofree.asia\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/1572053\/revisions\/1572282"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/radiofree.asia\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=1572053"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/radiofree.asia\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=1572053"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/radiofree.asia\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=1572053"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}